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AuthorTopic:   FAN POLL: Which handmadien name from Episode One do you like the best?
Giantano
Padawan Learner
posted 09-01-1999 04:18 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Giantano     Edit/Delete Message
Before I begin my Handmaiden dissertation, I need to quickly vent. What kind of parent takes two five-year olds to a movie that finishes at 1:00 A.M. on a weeknight?! Really, Im just wondering. If the kids need exercising by running around a movie theater, couldnt they go to the 7:30 showing? Okay, vent mode off. Im ready to share my observations from tonights viewing. Obi-Wan tried to distract ܥe# #,"l,"l"" " 5("""T"5 MS Sans Serif Symbol0Courier NewFAN POLL: Which handmadien name from Episode One do you like the best? - Jedi Council
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Yan of Naboo
Jedi Knight
posted 09-01-1999 08:25 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Yan of Naboo     Edit/Delete Message
I'm very impressed, Andy. Good work
(difficult to resist, Obi-Wan is, much focus and strength you have shown-If I weren't so lazy I would have put a pic of Yoda here)

Well, I've got to see the movie again, and try to catch a glimpse of Yan. Is there one good shot of her face in a scene? Then, when it is out on video I'll have at least one reference to use, I've plenty of other characters to draw until then.

I wonder why only four HMs were at the end scene. Symmetry? It seems that if one of them couldn't be in the scene(for some reason or an other) that a stand-in could be used.(they could have phoned me, I would have dropped everything and went


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Varrice
Jedi Knight
posted 09-01-1999 08:31 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Varrice   Click Here to Email Varrice     Edit/Delete Message
Excellent work, Giantano!!

So that leaves only two unsolved mysteries, no? Who the pseudohandmaiden stand-ins are in the "Congratulations, Chancellor" scene, and where Rab and Sach are sitting during the Flash Gordon news flash. That's not too bad. Handmaiden Watchers, you've all made good progress.

And any Handmaiden Watchers who are going to buy the TPM VHS release next year for further HM study, I desperately urge you to buy only the letterbox/widescreen edition of the film. At least 40% of all the important HM shots will have the HM's cropped offscreen in the pan & scan version -- including the Flash Gordon news flash, the scene in Palpatine's apartment, the scene in Amidala's ship (with Rab and Sab flanking the queen), and the final shot of the ending celebration.

I also noticed that this thread is up to 202 replies now. The handmaidens are worthy of it!

[This message has been edited by Varrice (edited 09-01-1999).]

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marcel_proust
Jedi Knight
posted 09-01-1999 09:39 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for marcel_proust   Click Here to Email marcel_proust     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
Who the pseudohandmaiden stand-ins are

You're kidding right? this has got to be a question too far,even for us

Yeah,roll on the video,but I am willing to bet that we will see a P&S version first followed a few months later by the W/S then
followed a few years later by the DVD.Ever get the feeling we're being played for mugs?


[This message has been edited by marcel_proust (edited 09-01-1999).]

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Lieutenant Piett
Jedi Knight
posted 09-01-1999 10:15 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Lieutenant Piett     Edit/Delete Message
(Over 200 posts! Yippee!!)

Superb scouting, Giantano, a.k.a. And. Handmaidenography took off after the last time (7th time, that is) I saw TPM. Now, of course, I HAFTA see it again...and it's nowhere within a 2-hour radius. Curses!
The HM's beckon . . . siren-like . . .

Anyway. Considering your report, I've a few hypotheses:

1. How much of a "details man" is Lucas? I think that he regards background characters more as props, thus allowing the actors who play them to be interchangeable, or concedable to cameos. Thus, it is possible that in the final shots, he didn't mind if a stand-in took on the role of any of the HM beyond Sab.
2. I read somewhere (sorry; don't remember) that GL cast Sofia Coppola as a gesture or favor toward his friend Francis Ford Coppola. I wonder if they just worked around Sofia's schedule for Rab, and didn't make demands on her, so they used a stand-in on days she couldn't make it.
3. During the Palpatine Hologram scene, it's just a bit too obvious that one of the HM chairs -- yellow, highbacked, against a pillar, behind the Regency -- is empty. If the mental camcorder serves me well, as the pan occurs, it is center-screen. I think GL subtly is cluing us in to the upcoming Decoy-switch; the empty chair is Sab's. She's off, maybe with the assistance of Yan, getting into the black-feather-headdress get-up. Even at that point, Amidala knew trouble was coming, and she'd better go into disguise.
4. There indeed were HM's at Qui-Gon's funeral -- maybe not all of them, but the shots taken may not have allowed for it. They were spaced out evenly among the room, like in the palace throne room -- a sense of balance? Indicative of the return to normalcy for Theed?

Still . . . there is work to be done!
Must...see...TPM...one more time!

The mystery of Yan remains. And -- need I say -- Sab! Sab! Sab! Sab!!!

Thanx again And!

marcel...yep; Emperor Lucas has got us right where he wants us. A legion of his best Marketing troops awaits us...

**Piett**

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Rebel Operative
Jedi Knight
posted 09-01-1999 02:26 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Rebel Operative   Click Here to Email Rebel Operative     Edit/Delete Message
Excellent posts, Giantano. Way to clear things up about the handmaidens. Thanks for the long post, it was worth it.

Great discussion, handmadien lovers. Let's go for more here....

May the Force be with you. Always.

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Rebel Operative
Jedi Knight
posted 09-01-1999 02:26 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Rebel Operative   Click Here to Email Rebel Operative     Edit/Delete Message
Excellent post, Giantano. Way to clear things up about the handmaidens. Thanks for the long post, it was worth it.

Great discussion, handmadien lovers. Let's go for more here....

May the Force be with you. Always.

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-02-1999 05:55 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
Project Handmaiden, TPM Expedition, Cairo, Egypt.

<The sun is blistering overhead as Professor Hernalt steps over the rubble and gear of an immense excavation in progress. Associate Intern Giantino is finishing her report on her recent find of Handmaiden gems. The Expedition's other Interns, Deans and Professors keenly watch over her shoulder.>

Professor Hernalt patiently scrutinizes the find, chipping off bits of encrusted sand. "By Jove, thot's good work, Giantano! And you're not even a Member yet! A promising career, indeed... 1) Rabe on the right of the Flash Gordon Transmission? 16) Rabe beside Sabe in the Disco Ball Parade? These are Intriguing developments, I must say!"

"Now, regarding the 4,5) Sabe vs. Rabe in Senate Appearance. According to the movie, Sabe accompanied Eirtae and Amidala to the Senate, but when they returned, there was a lull in the action as evinced by Amidala having time to stare out the window at the Coruscant skyline. It was during this time that Sabe took care to disappear or stay scarce, and Rabe took care to don the Senate Appearance Robe As If it had been Her that accompanied Amidala. She hence was on hand when Palpatine made his grand entrance and Panaka announced his nomination. Post Production Photography is scarce for the Senate Appearance ensemble, but should it exist, it would logically include Rabe rather than Sabe. But If Eirtae-Amidala-Sabe ensemble footage or photography exists, it would nicely accompany the Rabe-Amidala-Sabe in the 6) Return to Naboo scene, of which we have surviving footage."

"Also, I noticed the conjecture on the empty seat in the 2) first Theed Throne Room scene. We just need to remember that upon a first viewing, the audience would have no inkling that the Queen had any more Handmaidens than were briefly shown. The empty chair would, for the first viewing, have no foreshadowing capacity, but Would gain such in subsequent viewings."

"8) And Yes, Panaka wos most entertaining. I loved every one of his lines. Hmm... So 9) Eirtae Refrained and Allowed the Jedi to deal with things... Very Astute! That would make Rabe the next... Laura Croft!"

"13) Another mysterious face? Now why am I not surprised? Well, we can only be constrained that it cannot be Yane or Sache, as they were still in the custody of the Trade Federation and had no part in the Assault on Theed. So if an unknown it must be, it would have to be a Stand-in for Rabe or Eirtae."

"14) "The Chancellor Returns to Naboo scene was a pick-up scene, determined as necessary by Lucas at the last minute and not shot until Late 1998, August I believe. That is the same scene in which Samuel L Jackson was unavailable as was depicted by a stand-in. So... We'd almost have to conclude that None of the Handmaiden actresses (But Rabe)were available for the scene, Or it was beyond the terms of their contract to need show up for this scene which was beyond the Principle Photography. This follows, if you follow me, that the 3) Amidala's Chambers scene, which was Also a pick-up scene shot no earlier than late 1998, May have Only had Rabe, Christina da Silva, as the only available Handmaiden actress, which would have made the two Handmaidens standing Behind Amidala in the Senate Appearance Gowns......... Extras, or Stand-Ins."

"Professor Piett echoes my thoughts on Sofia Coppola. Considering her busy schedule as an actress, screenwriter and director, it would be easy to conclude that she could only have appeared in a minimum of TPM scenes. The only fact in opposition to this is that she Was in Leavesden Studios, England, in order to appear in the Theed Hangar scenes. But it is reasonable to surmise that she may have not been available for the Disco Ball Parade, and was merely struck from the screenplay without need for a Stand-In, per Lucas' sense of visual symmetry."

"But I must part with Professor Piett over the interpretation of the Empty Handmaiden Chair. The Amidala Journal, apocryphal as it is, yet states that Amidala's decision to employ Sabe as the decoy Queen did not occur until After the communications disruption, when she was looking out the Palace window as the Trade Federation army entered Theed. One supporting point I could offer is that the Black Peacock Dress (I'm not certain if it was dubbed the 'Traveling Gown') required no elaborate hair-work and could be quickly donned by Sabe as easily as Amidala could don the rainbow robe of the Handmaidens as Padme."

Professor Hernalt steps back out of the excavation, amazed by both the amount of work accomplished and that yet to do.

[This message has been edited by Hernalt (edited 09-02-1999).]

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Rabe
Jedi Knight
posted 09-02-1999 06:01 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Rabe     Edit/Delete Message
Take a wild stab in the dark.

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Lieutenant Piett
Jedi Knight
posted 09-02-1999 06:38 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Lieutenant Piett     Edit/Delete Message
(P.S. Upon the automatic return to the board after initially posting this, I saw Prof. Hernalt's coincidental and like-minded post! So; I revise and address accordingly...)

Well! So last night, letting go of my conscious self and acting on instinct (and a lot of caffeine), I travelled 2 hours south to see TPM One Last Time before it disappeared from the theaters (and as a nod toward the coming End of Summer '99). This was impulsive; sorry I could not give advance notice so as to solicit any possible remaining questions la Giantano above. Ah -- to see the once-glorified TPM now faint and picked dry, the Hype gone, ironically viewed in a near-empty theater in the same town in which I saw its midnight, crowded, boisterous premiere a few short months ago!

But I digress. I offer you a Royal Handmaiden Society Member's report, corroborating And's report and then some:

1. Sach and Yan remain the most, ah, phantom of the bunch. Apart from you-know-who, Rab and Eirta indeed back up Amidala the most, beyond the parts away from Naboo; I concur that it is indeed those two who flank Amidala's throne during the Flash Gordon/Palpatine hologram sequence, and affect similar placement in Palpatine's senate-quarters. Indeed, they also "stick together" -- Rab leading -- during the final Theed Palace battle sequence, in which Sab gets into it in a serious way.

2. Yep; I was right about that empty chair. In fact it appears to "move thru" Palatine's hologram as the camera pans...

Prof. Hernalt -- Dear Fellow, I see your points. But, at the risk of falling prey to the curse of the English-literature major and "reading too much into it", I propose three points:
i. That friggin' chair is just too obvious. It's in the center of the shot, almost counterbalancing the camera.
ii. The apocryphal Queen's Journal may be a generation removed from the shooting script, and thus take liberties and assumptions -- i.e., the Queen's thoughts.
iii. The empty chair could imply its expected occupancy by sheer context -- we see all other similar chairs occupied by Handmaidens, and no other empty chairs in the room -- the most important room on the planet at that point. Thus, it would suggest to the viewer, "by all accounts, another yellow-robd Handmaiden should be here, yet, isn't! Note my vacancy!"

3. The only time the R/E "wingman formation" (pardon the gender-spec. term) behind Amidala is excepted is during the trip back to Naboo; yes, that's Sab on screen right (I'd recognize those lips anywhere now -- ).

4. The Forest scene of R/E/Sb w/Anakin is the Still-shot of the century for me now. Anyone seen it on a trading card or anything?

5. Who's with Amidala in the Senate pod? Not enough info. But my moolah's on R & E -- maintaining the "wingman" formation.

(I guess I am not as quick as Giantano on this -- "pale skin, thin lips" of Eirtae? I couldn't tell -- good catch!)

6. A blunder: three HM's should not have been seen when Anakin drops by before going to the Jedi Council. "Padm's not here right now"? Well, you've got the Queen and *three* HM's there; that's what we left Naboo with, so logically one of 'em has got to be Padm, right!? D'oh! Anakin can see things before they happen, sure, but apparently not as they happen right in front of him.

7. Qui-Gon's funeral: too tight of a shot to see the whole room. No HM's apparent; focuses are on the main characters and the Jedi Council.

8. Yan, is that you, finally?? As seen together various times, R, Sb, and E are all taller than Amidala. But just before the parade, when Palpatine lies his Sith ass off to Amidala about bringing peace and prosperity blah blah blah, we see a short, square-faced HM face-on. HM Yan, I presume?

(Interesting, informative and very likely note though on the possibility of Stand-In's per Prof. Hernalt.)

9. I guess Sofia Coppola's schedule was tighter than I thought -- Sach's even less
of a presence than Yan if #8 is true.

10. I figure Kiera's voice was replaced with the digitally-pitch-shifted voice of Natalie; probably all the relevant "Queen" lines were recorded in one session by NP, to maintain consistency. Clue: lips aren't synching up. (Ach!-- there's my fixation on Kiera's mouth again...)

11. Kiera triumphant: The last Close-up of the movie is of Obi-Wan (as seen on page 3 of this thread) -- and, that means right behind him is Sab-- and I know that face!. (Seeing this on the big screen helped tremendously)

12. I cracked up every time Ric Oli said something.

Cut to the Happy Naboo group shot and then to the credits, then to the two drunk guys behind me stumbling past me to the exit.

*Okay* Enough indulgence. Last splurge of this SW season last nite was for me . . .

...but...Long live the Handmaidens, and the Royal Handmaiden Society!

**Piett**

[This message has been edited by Lieutenant Piett (edited 09-02-1999).]

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-02-1999 07:48 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
The Royal Handmaiden Society is in need of another series of votes from the Panel.

1) Is it Rabe or Sabe who accompanies Amidala and Eirtae to the Senate Appearance? Each had the motive and opportunity.

(...I cannot be dead certain it is Rabe, as she Could Have changed into the Senate Appearance gown between Anakin's exit and their Senate Appearance. My thoughts are based on the logic of doing so: Sabe would make just as capable an Accompanying handmaiden as Rabe. There is no reason, in terms of her bodyguard/decoy capacity, for Sabe to be apart from Amidala, as if she were a Vice-Queen or something akin to the Vice-President who flies in a different plane than the President. In fact, if Amidala preferred the more defensively capable of the three, she'd take Sabe the sure-shot and Rabe who at least 'got into' the Theed Assault.)

2) The Yellow Hooded Handmaidens for the Palpatine Returns to Naboo scene - are they stand-ins or is it Yane in the front and a stand-in behind her?

(...I am dead certain that neither of them can be Sache, and am completely certain that neither of them are Yane, as their faces appear to me too old - that of a woman in her thirties and a barely younger woman behind her. My first thoughts of the front woman was that she had a Spanish *look*, or that she even looked Not a Little like Jedi Master Depa Billaba. So Professor Piett and I are keenly interested in the Panel's opinion.)

3) Does anyone have any final scoop on Portman's voice? The last I heard, there were no voice reductions, nor voiceovers. Sabe-Amidala's voice is Knightley's deliberately lower-modulated voice; Padme's voice is Portman's normal voice; and Real-Amidala's voice is Portman's deliberately but not artificially lowered affectation of a 1930's British actresses' accent.

(...BUT!!! I never noticed Sabe-Amidala's lip-non-sync. And don't mention fixations, Professor Piett, or I'll have to tell you about my dream with Sabe. And she's not even my true love! )

(I noticed Anakin's mathematic skills on viewing #6: 1 Queen + 1 Padme + 2 anonymous Handmaidens does NOT equal 1 Queen + 3 Handmaidens right under his nose - 1 Padme sent on an errand!! Boy was he giddy to see Padme! Couldn't even count straight!)

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marcel_proust
Jedi Knight
posted 09-02-1999 08:14 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for marcel_proust   Click Here to Email marcel_proust     Edit/Delete Message
More pics anyone ?

Check my site for updates to the filmography section.

Kiera Knightley - Queen of The Phantom Menace

[This message has been edited by marcel_proust (edited 09-02-1999).]

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Lieutenant Piett
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 02:02 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Lieutenant Piett     Edit/Delete Message
Prof. Hernalt -- my esteemed colleague! The mystery of the Senate pod...may have to wait til next March for me at least! My Last Push for TPM last night was too close to a Kamikaze mission to repeat. Mainly because I showed up at the wrong theater at first, to the bemusement of the ticket-droid. Meaning, I had to hit the lightspeed on I-95. Anywhat...

I'd still cast my lot with Rab as being the Senatorial One, though.

Hmmmm...I read somewhere (not exactly being scholarly here) in amidst the media frenzy around the time of TPM's premiere that in fact, NP's voice was digitally pitch-shifted for Amidala. Perhaps, though, not for every line? Perhaps, "only when she's making a formal presentation." Hmmm.

Her first lines in the film sound really, really low in timbre, at least in comparison to other lines like "Jar Jar binx, I need your help."

Sab in your dreams?? :O Are we both suffering chosen-HM dysphasia?? Really -- no kidding here -- Eirta was in my dreams recently. I don't usually go fer blondes.

**Piett**

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Giantano
Padawan Learner
posted 09-03-1999 03:25 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Giantano     Edit/Delete Message
We are a hardworking and dedicated group! I am so proud of us.

After reading everyone's responses to my observations, I thought I would add a few more things.

Regarding the empty chair debate. I just wanted to state that my notes from the last showing say there are TWO empty chairs in the Theed Throne Room. One on the left, one on the right. Is this for six handmaidens the Queen may need? Symmetry? Aesthetics? I'm not sure. However, I hesitate to use this as foreshadowing as there was more than one empty chair. Sorry guys.

Piett, you drove two hours to see Episode I!? Now that's dedication. The longest I every drove was the 30 minutes to Burbank to see the digital screening. I admire your commitment to the HM.

One more thing to add to our checklist. I need someone else to verify that there is a stand-in for Rab in the "This one's a decoy!" scene. I'm 99% sure it isn't her, but it was almost 1 A.M., I was tired, so I would be grateful for someone else's observation.

Oh, and Hernalt, when you spotted Sofia/Sach in the Throne Room, was she the one on the left, next to Panaka, or on the right behind Bibble?

Think that's it for now. Until next time.

MTFBWY,
And

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jailbird
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 05:44 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for jailbird   Click Here to Email jailbird     Edit/Delete Message
Padme's got my vote!
Who else says more than a few words!

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 08:51 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
Hello, Rabe. ...Is it getting hot in here...?

Piett, you only dream about the ones you're not after... Oh, yeah... Padme was in the same dream as Sabe. No kidding.

<Sigh> I wonder who will visit next...

Giantino, I figured it was Sache behind Sio Bibble.

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Yan of Naboo
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 09:23 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Yan of Naboo     Edit/Delete Message
Symmetry

It just occurred to me how often that word keeps coming up. (four HM at Parade scene why? Symmetry? two unoccupied chairs in throne room, why? Symmetry?)

Personally what I was impressed with most in the movie were the visuals (I really don't mean SFX I mean art direction. I think that is the right word.) Now when I go see the movie again I'm going to have to watch for all the shots set up to be symmetrical. (I'm really obsessing a little too much

It seems to me that having five HMs throws off symmetry. Many shots show Amidala flanked by HMs. Usually the shots are designed to appear symmetrical. So why five HMs? why not four or six? (I know I'm being overly analytical but half the threads in this forum are ridiculously over-analytical)

Well anywho--up to the top!

MTFBWY....always. Yan

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 09:50 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
On symmetry, I was only smirked by the overly CGI'ed and perfect symmetry when the Feds marched into Theed. The score was great, the visuals were just too pat and happy. Other than that, TPM's art nouveau and symmetry were pleasing. There is also a form of mental symmetry inherent in symbiosis, rarely visually depicted. The Jedi Coucil was six-fold symmetric, the Senate infinitely symmetric.

Regarding 4 vs. 5 vs. 6 Handmaidens: One's a guest, two's company, three's a crowd, four's a gang, five's a mob, six is a nation. (yeah I made that up...)

Why five? Because five is the most naturally occuring number of flower petals. More flowers have five petals than do four or six. And the Queen with her Handmaiden retinue are a bouquet, so they are symmetric with nature, if you will, just as the Gungan technology was in harmony with it. The Theed architecture is clearly Mediterranean, festooned with garlands, seemingly during all seasons (if Naboo has seasons). So Theed is harmonious, if not organic, but is decored as if it were organic. And the Queen and her Handmaidens are but the motif of the greatest, grandest resident bouquet.

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Yan of Naboo
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 10:48 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Yan of Naboo     Edit/Delete Message
All right, Hernalt, I'll go along with your reason. flower petals So just to kill time until TPM comes out on video (I've got a long wait. Patience is a virtue, and it's a good thing I've plenty of it) I was wondering what sort of flower do you think they symbolize? Remember it has to have exactly five petals. How about a pansy or a violet? (I'm pretty sure that they both have five petals)

BTW right now I should be rereading a passage from a book we're discussing in class today instead of typing out this silly post.
Maybe I should check out the slacker thread.

MTFBWY...always Yan

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 11:22 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
They could be a wild, single rose: http://www.berkeleyhort.com/wildro.htm

A buttercup: http://www.ceres.ca.gov/tcsf/tahoe-local/wildflowers.html

A passion flower: http://www.ag.usask.ca/cofa/departments/hort/hortinfo/plants/passion.html

Or a hibiscus: http://www.santabarbaramayor.com/flower.html

...depending on what they're wearing.

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Lieutenant Piett
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 11:25 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Lieutenant Piett     Edit/Delete Message
jailbird -- heh heh -- I've found that no matter how much you intend to say a few words, it always just snowballs...watch what's about to happen...

Hernalt -- Most profound! An excellent inquiry into the Art Direction of the flick, as Yan brought up above.

The real joy here is that the Handmaidens metaphorically help carry a major theme of the story: that of duality/identity/symmetry.
Am I on the right track here?

Fives - five can be symmetrical, as long as one element is in the middle. Fives rule. Five beats to the bar, cool daddy-o. Take five. Pardon me as I riff on this theme (cue Beat jazz improv jam --)

Envision (gee, for lack of an FTP program, we have to rely on mental imagery! Long live Imagination): the top half of a clock face, with demarcations at "9", "10:30", "12", "1:30", and "3". In this scheme applied to HMography, Amidala is the point in the center of the clock face; Sab -- her double, her shadow -- would be the "12" point.

Duality + polarity = Symmetry. Polarized dualites in TPM: Naboo vs. Gungans; regimented beaurocracy vs. an intuitive, direct approach (the Senate vs. Amidala, and the Jedi council vs. QGJ); Sith vs. Jedi master/apprentice relationships. All these are dynamic, too; the Naboo and Gungans de-polarize and unify, harmoniously; Amidala circumnavigates the Senate and QGJ ultimately gets his wish approved by the JC;
a Sith apprentice and a Jedi Master are both killed.

Tension, and Release.
Amidala has a dual identity throughout the film until this is resolved also. (Conversely, it could be said that Sab has a dual identity, until she is also allowed to "just be herself.") Polarities: Amidala's identities are strong in nature(the True Queen; Padm); Sab's are weak (the Decoy Queen; generic Handmaiden ) until Resolution.

The strong force, the weak force (of Physics); the Living Force, the Cosmic Force; the Dark Side, the Light Side.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Giantano -- actually, it should have been only and hour and change, but, uh, the coordinates didn't come in from the Navi-computer right. In other words, I got lost!

How was the Digital screening? Did you notice much of a difference? The nearest digital production here on the "right" coast was North Jersey, which I didn't feel like messing with...

And...yeah, life may be too short to contemplate Empty Chairs! Still -- I can't shake that image as being somehow significant!

BTW, fellow Society Panelists...Sith Acolyte, Namer of the P(SA) Tribes, promoted me to General recently. Should I accept the promotion?

**Piett**

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 02:40 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
Wow. HMology now includes the study of pentagonal symmetry! (Dualism is only one symmetry.) http://www.nottingham.ac.uk/education/number/Num5.htm

Your top-of-the-clock image reminded me of a fan or peacock, even Amidala's peacock headdress. For me it raised some attractive image ideas: If Sabe-as-Queen is at noon, she is the double, the shadower, yet that which is highest, exerting authority and most prominent to the 'sunlight' of attention. If Padme-as-HM is in the center, she is shadowed and protected, obeying 'her' queen, yet the foundation and source of a quiet authority. But If Sabe-as-Queen is in the center, she is the double, the shadow, unable to exert authority, yet the main emotional support to the real queen. If Padme-as-HM is at noon, she is the Queen revealed, shown to be humble in mind even with power, equal to her Handmaidens, like at the Gungan-Naboo alliance. (Or with Qui-Gon if you subscribe that he knew Padme was the queen right away.)

Or, Amidala was the democratically elected orchid, who proliferated, and assembled to herself, five flowers flattering in shape and hue, thus to compose a bouquet.

And Sabe with the duel identity! That is heart-rendingly poignant! We can't just toss her off as the Queen's mere employee; her emotional support in the Amidala Journal assigns her much more value than the movie could.

So did the Royal Handmaiden Society become recognized as a PSA tribe..?

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Rebel Operative
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 03:29 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Rebel Operative   Click Here to Email Rebel Operative     Edit/Delete Message
jailbird: Rabe says more than just a few words.

RABE: I'm sorry, Annie, but Padme is not here right now.

AMIDALA: Who is it?

RABE: Anakin Skywlkker to see Padme, your Highness.

I LOVE Rabe's accent. It's so good words can't describe it alone.

[This message has been edited by Rebel Operative (edited 09-03-1999).]

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Qui-Gon's Padawan
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 09:08 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Qui-Gon's Padawan   Click Here to Email Qui-Gon's Padawan     Edit/Delete Message
We need more handmaidens pictures here!


Rab(left) and Eirta(right)


From left to right: Eirta, Rab, Sach and Yan (I think)


Eirta, Rab, Sab (as Queen Amidala) and Padm


Sab (as Amidala), Rab and Padm


Rab, Sab (as Amidala) and Eirta


[This message has been edited by Qui-Gon's Padawan (edited 09-04-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Qui-Gon's Padawan (edited 09-06-1999).]

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-03-1999 09:46 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
WHAAA! You're gonna knock someone's Eyes out!

Excellent and Beautiful captures! I had mentioned bouquets...

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Sabes Decoy
Padawan Learner
posted 09-04-1999 01:18 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Sabes Decoy   Click Here to Email Sabes Decoy     Edit/Delete Message
Wow. . .I'm not the only Handmaiden fan in existance! This is SO cool! (Wizard?)

Anyway, cast my vote for Sabe' as the coolest Handmaiden.

Now, on to the hot topics:

1.) I cast my vote for Sabe' as the Maiden behind Obi in the 'Disco Ball' Parade.

2.) According to Star Wars: The Phantom Menace Illustrated Screen play, Rabe' and Eirtae' accompany Amidala to the Senate. Take it as you will. It still strikes me as silly though that Sabe' would stay behind.

3.) Sabe' is absent for most of the battle in the hanger. I can only assume that is becasue she is in hiding, as part of the plan that is set in motion upon the 'capture' of Amidala and her troops. Wouldn't do too much good for the Nemoids to see Sabe ( who they think is the Queen) running around if they need to capture Padme'.

Anyway, I am SO glad that this is here!!!

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-04-1999 08:30 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
I'd like to think that while Sabe and Eirtae accompanied Amidala to the Senate Appearance, Rabe maybe went out, did some shopping, turned a few heads... had some cappucino. Came back... maybe had a deeply involved discussion with that Naboo Palace Guard... And wrote some more in her diary.

Sabe's Decoy, there was one specific shot which showed Sabe-Amidala firing, the next frame showed a Battle Droid going down. So what she may have lacked in screen time she conpensated for in value. That girl can shoot!

And then:

quote:
Amidala Journal Pg 103: We scaled the exterior wall of the palace. Captain Panak blasted out a window. We swung inside. The throne room was only a few feet away.

"Everyone stay together," Panaka warned.I exchanged a look with Sabe, and she drifted toward the rear of the group. It was the only part of the plan I'd kept secret from the others. I took a position next to Panaka.


- Interesting. So Sabe and the gang Rapunzelled the walls After Padme-Amidala was already up on the next level.

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Lieutenant Piett
Jedi Knight
posted 09-04-1999 08:09 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Lieutenant Piett     Edit/Delete Message
Qui-Gon's Padawan -- superb! Thanx for bringing back something for the eyes here...too much text, despite all the equally colorful mental imagery...

I hafta say, tho, in the second pic above (back of Obi-Wan's head) -- that's Eirta on the far left of the pic, then Sab of course, then Rab... the skin tones give it away.

To be a Royal Handmaiden Society Member is to become an expert in recognizing lower-halves of faces! (Not that I dare qualify myself as an Expert or anything...)

I still have to go with R and E accompanying Amidala to the Senate -- consistency-factor again. Important factoid that Sab's Decoy (heh heh) brought up from the published screenplay. I think Sab laid low and did the Royal Laundry in the meantime. (Well, someone had to)...

Yep; Sab was in the hangar-battle alright, sending Battle Droids on a one-way-ticket to Silicon Heaven (any Red Dwarf fans here...?)...single-shot bas@$$ that she is. Oy!

Prof.Hernalt (and all distinguished RHMS Members) -- to continue the "noon/clockface" imagery -- could we indeed assert a sun/moon dichotomy here?
The above pic of Sab -- white face, black headdress, much like the full moon -- sent me off on this.

When Amidala blows her own cover at the critical appeal-to-Nass point, she emerges like the sun from behind the clouds of deception (or rises above the obscuring horizon?), to illuminate the way to salvation with noon-bright radiance. Thus she takes the "12" spot on the clock-face -- high noon, the sun at its peak. Sab, her counterbalance as the full moon (and the moon can only appear full when directly opposite the sun), thus now sets; the sun reigns on high now. The mysterious night of deception is over; the day of salvation can now begin.

Bill, what do you have to say about this...?

quote:
"Yet herein will I imitate the sun, / Who doth permit the base and contagious clouds to smother up his beauty from the world, / That, when he please again to be himself, / Being wanted, he may be more wond'red at / By breaking through the foul and ugly mists / Of vapors that did seem to strangle him." -- Prince Henry, in Shakespeare's Henry IV I.2 ln185-191

When Amidala pleased to be herself again, she broke through the mists of deception, freeing Sab to be herself again too.

Needless to say, I'm a "night person," myself. Arise, o fair moon...

**Piett**

[This message has been edited by Lieutenant Piett (edited 09-04-1999).]

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Qui-Gon's Padawan
Jedi Knight
posted 09-04-1999 08:54 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Qui-Gon's Padawan   Click Here to Email Qui-Gon's Padawan     Edit/Delete Message
Lieutenant Piett, the picture with the back of Obi-Wan's head is the same that the one in the Visual Dictionnary (p.27), and they identified the handmaiden to the left as Rab. But it's true that her skin is too pale, and she looks like Eirta, while the HM between Sab and Panaka looks more like Rab. Could they have made a mistake in the Visual Dictionnary?

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Yan of Naboo
Jedi Knight
posted 09-04-1999 09:30 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Yan of Naboo     Edit/Delete Message
Welcome, Sabe's Decoy
(you'll be even more welcome if you can shed any light onto the Yan mystery )

Qui-Gon's Padawan I believe that the visual dictionary is indeed wrong. Rab and Eirta are switched. Compare the larger photos of Rab and Eirta (correctly labeled on the same page as the oval picture) to the smaller picture.

MTFBWY...always. Yan (proud member of the Royal Handmaiden Society)

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-04-1999 09:47 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
QGP, the Visual Dictionary switched the captions for Rabe and Eirtae, but it also had more conspicious errors elsewhere.

Nobody agrees Rabe stayed behind?! I'll have to keep her company, then.

'I think Bill Himself would compose a beauteous lay
Of our Handmaidens, ere he a-breath today.
Ode sweet to the ear, traits humble and dear
He would announce their hue, their fragrance clear
On the airs of spring, the seasons taught
In respective face, their visage bought
Dearly by sweetened eye, 'Our hearts! we cry,
And despair of their equal, our love we bid fly.'

-Hernalt. Full-time Handmaidenologist, Amateur poet.

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Yan of Naboo
Jedi Knight
posted 09-05-1999 08:18 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Yan of Naboo     Edit/Delete Message
Well, I'm here to rescue the thread from the evil grasp of page three. (I hate to have to hunt for this thread)

I hate to just write that so...
I drew a picture of Rab this afternoon. It's a relatively simple sketch (not colored pencils like my picture of Amidala) I'm tempted to redo it in pen and ink. Anyway- I think it is a pretty good likeness. Next up... Eirta. I'd hate to run out of HMs before the mystery of Yan is solved.

BTW is the RHS (Royal HM Society) an official tribe yet? If so can I be an official member?

To the top, I say! Yan

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Rebel Operative
Jedi Knight
posted 09-05-1999 08:29 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Rebel Operative   Click Here to Email Rebel Operative     Edit/Delete Message
Hernalt, I love Rabe too. Sounds like you're starting to have a personal interest in her writing a poem like that. I might just get jealous.

Just writing to keep this thread on top, my friends.

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-05-1999 08:36 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
Well, Rebel, it just so happens that I ran into Rabe at a RP chat last night. I enjoyed her company. In fact, I seem to remember waking up with a lingering memory of her being in my dreams. Amazing what the Internet does.

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Rebel Operative
Jedi Knight
posted 09-05-1999 08:43 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Rebel Operative   Click Here to Email Rebel Operative     Edit/Delete Message
I've got to stay on the Internet more, Hernalt.

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Varrice
Jedi Knight
posted 09-05-1999 08:46 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Varrice   Click Here to Email Varrice     Edit/Delete Message
Wow, I'm offline for a few days and you guys/gals have written a bunch of epistles! You all leave me in the dust. Nice pictures, too.

Yan of Naboo, any chance of seeing these sketches of yours on the web after you've completed them? If they're good enough, you might even have a high demand for signed lithographs.

Well, I'll leaving you all again tomorrow... off to New York City for a week. And we all know what New York City means: discount theaters which still have TPM double matinees! So naturally, the Varrice will be spending at least one full afternoon on HM research.

I'll see if there's sufficient new material for a mini-dissertation next Monday. So long.


<om... Sab Padm Yan om... om... Rab Sach om... om...>

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Arsinoe
Jedi Knight
posted 09-05-1999 09:13 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Arsinoe   Click Here to Email Arsinoe     Edit/Delete Message
Very interesting thread gentle people!! Very good research everyone!!

Hummm my vote.. well it would have to be for Rabe .. she is *different* from the rest!!

Nice theory of Rabe's activities during the Senate scene Hernalt .. I would hope the Queen would give her handmaiden's some time off from their duties now and again!!

Enjoyed that RP chat, eh Hern!! They are fun aren't they!!

[This message has been edited by Arsinoe (edited 09-05-1999).]

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Hernalt
Jedi Knight
posted 09-06-1999 05:08 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Hernalt   Click Here to Email Hernalt     Edit/Delete Message
Hi, Arsinoe. This is our clubhouse. So.............. You know about those RP chats, too?

Here's more fanpic (not mine):

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Arsinoe
Jedi Knight
posted 09-06-1999 09:18 PM    Click Here to See the Profile for Arsinoe   Click Here to Email Arsinoe     Edit/Delete Message
Nice clubhouse Hernalt!! Interesting ... ummm picture! Yes, I know about RP chats .. embarassed myself at a few of them I'm afraid!

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Lieutenant Piett
Jedi Knight
posted 09-07-1999 02:44 AM    Click Here to See the Profile for Lieutenant Piett     Edit/Delete Message

Great fanpic Hernalt...and sonnet too...

(Hope you had) Good luck on your mission to the NYC System, Varrice...

Are we a Tribe yet? We must petition Sith Acolyte. I can't guage if such a move is right, tho, right now; he's one of the grumpier of the Bashers, it seems , who are currently in exile over in Miscellaneous, in an abandoned wharf-front warehouse...

He did, however, recently promote me to General (the paperwork has yet to go thru, though) ("someone must have told him about my maneuver in the Battle of tkip's 'Lucas has One Major Flaw' thread!"), so I just may have found some favor with him...

QG's P -- Yep; I say the editors of the E1 Visual Dictionary erred. I wonder if they were the same brain-trust of careless callow b@$+@rdz who royally shortchanged the Royal HM's in the E1 Insider's Guide CD-R (does anyone else here know of what I speak? ONE picture. ONE. Of them in the background, backs turned to the camera, as they are hurried out of the Theed plaza after QGJ & ObiWan show up). Slackers. Negligents. Feh.

Other great news......thumbed thru the new ish of Insider's Guide and, lo and behold: nada, not one crumb, nay, not one nod of Recognition toward the HM's nor the actresses who make them live & breathe (sigh).

But HEY...there's like 200 pages dedicated to...[covering mouth and coughing while saying] A**** S***. Ahem. #*!@*+?##%#@$%@$!!!!

Ain't no justice in this universe.

<blues>Ain't no sunshine when she's gone...</blues>

(there's that sun imagery again!!)

Noted also: there's a few stray pix of HM's in the "Making Of Episode I" book. No tengo dinero o scanner, so just trust me on this. There's this one shot with Eirta/Friday out of focus in the background and I know it's her 'coz them blue, blue eyes appear to leap right out at ya.

Still...Sab Sab Sab Sab Sab Sab!!!

Signing off for tonite, Fellow RHS Members, I bid you, that "We are brave, your Highness."

**Piett**

[This message has been edited by Lieutenant Piett (edited 09-07-1999).]

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